Hoboken Mom Condo Living
Planning the long-term & juggling the everyday

Hi Kathy,

I’ve seen your blog and have found it very interesting reading. Is there any chance you might be able to offer advice from a realtor’s point of view so that my husband and I don’t unintentionally behave inappropriately and become nightmare clients for our realtor. What I mean is that we have a history with our realtor. When we bought our previous little 1 bedroom in Hoboken in 2000 our realtor represented the seller. Then we found out she lived in our building. So, we were neighbors for the six years we lived there and then we used her to sell our condo before we moved to London. I meant no disrespect to her when I posted a message on the Yahoo Hoboken Moms site. I simply thought I’d take advantage of all avenues available that might help us find a condo we really like. I’ve had two responses from people who were planning to put their condo up for sale but have not yet listed with an agent, and whose condos sound like a potential match for us, and who have invited us to come view them. This is where I want to make sure we do the right thing and not disrespect our agent who is working for us trying to find us the right place. Is it inappropriate to now go and view a condo without our agent? Should we contact her and ask her to accompany us to the viewings? Are we likely to annoy her by telling her we’ve found places we’d like to view without her? I don’t know how to proceed from here and have a feeling like I might have done something “wrong” from a realtor’s point of view. From our point of view, we’re just desperate to find a condo to settle in and call home and want to do anything we can to find it without behaving unethically or offensively.

Any advice would be greatly, greatly appreciated!

Best wishes,
G.

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My answer:

Hi, G.,

Hoo boy, that is a really sensitive area. First of all, let me be clear that I am not a realtor. I am coming at this from a buyer’s standpoint, the same as you. That said, I know a fair amount about MLS rules. Not anywhere as much as a realtor knows, but more than most people. So glad to hear you find my blog useful, it’s always great to get feedback from other moms so I know I’m not just talking to myself!

You didn’t do anything wrong by posting your notice on HobokenMoms. You are legally allowed to view ANY apartment with a different realtor. You could see five apartments with five different realtors and it would be totally legit. The only obligation you have to your realtor is that you have to place an offer on a unit that she showed you through her. If you make an offer either on your own or through another realtor, that would be a definite MLS violation and she would have grounds to sue you and the other realtor.

That being said, there is kind of an unspoken agreement that you owe something to the realtor who got you up to speed on the market. If you have a relationship with a realtor and she is the only one who is showing you properties, then 99.9% of realtors would feel that you owe them the commission in exchange for the time they invested in you. That ONLY applies to MLS listings, however. In a FSBO transaction, such as the two owners who contacted you, the seller has no obligation to pay a realtor fee. You can tell your realtor about the FSBO sales but legally the seller does not have to pay a fee and most likely will refuse to do so.

What can happen in situations like this is that the buyer independently pays a fee to their realtor. That is very, very rare, but I have spoken to realtors who have seen it happen. The other problem is pricing. Typically FSBO sellers are looking to sell their property at the same price as they would have through the MLS, which means they get to keep the commission they would have paid to the realtor. It is highly unlikely they will drop the sale price enough to compensate for the fee (typically 5%; on a $700k sale that works out to $35k). That means that you will have to pay the market price PLUS a voluntary fee to your realtor.

You can certainly try to bargain down the sellers to make them drop the price enough. However, I have found that sellers are FSBO for a reason; because they don’t have a gun to their heads to sell and want to try to sell on their own first before going with a realtor. That lack of urgency almost invariably means they price their units too high and are unrealistic about the true market value of their property. Every single owner I know, including me, thinks their property is worth the absolute maximum possible. It usually takes a few months of dealing with showings to make owners get realistic and drop their price two or three times down to fair market value.

When you make it easy for them by appearing out of nowhere and want to buy their unit, they haven’t had a chance to experience the true grinding ordeal of listing their unit and so are almost always very difficult to negotiate with (ie. you make a low offer, they get insulted and refuse to counteroffer).

The flip side of the realtor compensation structure is that it’s like hitting the lottery. 99% of their clients wind up not buying, so they waste a lot of time on people who don’t pay off. It’s buyers like you and me, who only look when we are truly serious, who are their fantasy. In the three times I have bought properties, I spent exactly one day each time going to showings, so I estimate my realtors have gotten compensated at well over $1k/hour. That’s just crazy, you don’t owe anyone that kind of payoff.

What I suggest if you do buy FSBO is calculate roughly how many hours your realtor has spent on you, both on showings and doing research on your behalf. Multiply that times $50, and then make sure your final sales price is low enough that you can pay that amount to your realtor. The MLS contracts I have signed that allow me to sell FSBO include an addendum allowing for $2k payment to the realtor if I sell on my own to compensate them for the time spent marketing my unit. That is usually more than fair on an hourly basis.

If your realtor agrees to this structure, definitely bring her along to the FSBO showings to help you negotiate. She can prove her worth by giving you comparables of recent sales to help support your offer, and give you advice about the contract details and closing docs (ie. flood insurance). That is where a good realtor can really shine. I can’t promise you that she won’t be pissed that you are pursuing FSBO sales, but if you are upfront with her about your plan, then any reasonable realtor will be okay with it. She won’t be happy, but she won’t be furious.

Kathy

Hi Kathy,

I came across your blog randomly with a Google search on Hoboken living.  You are a talented writer and provide SO much information.  I truly appreciate all the information you provide on a daily basis!  Here’s a little background on myself and I’m hoping you can answer some of my questions about living in Hoboken.

My husband and I  are expecting a baby in December.  We currently live in Passaic County.  We reside in a spacious townhouse with a wonderful community and our next door neighbors are our best friends.  I teach nearby, which is a short 10-minute commute but my husband works in the city which door to door is almost an 1 and 45 minutes each way on NJ transit and the Path.  With a baby on the way, I would love to have him home earlier…plus after 10 years of commuting this way, he’s getting burned out.

My husband and I actually met in Hoboken almost 5 years ago.  I was living there at the time and loved it but worked 3 jobs to maintain my Hoboken lifestyle!  He has also lived there (over 10 years ago) and always felt that Hoboken was a ticking clock when it came to living there.  Once people started having families, the alarm went off and up they moved to the suburbs.

We still have friends that live in Hoboken and we frequently visit them.  We have noticed a huge influx of baby strollers and young families in the area and have started to do some home searches.  We were pleasantly surprised to find a lot of new(er) condos in our price range and with adequate space!  We are now seriously considering moving back to the area and building a family there.  My husband would be home a lot earlier and my commute will only double (20 minutes…not too bad) and we are so into the healthy lifestyle that Hoboken can provide us, which you also mentioned in one of your blog entries.

Sorry for the long intro, but now here are my questions:

1.  Being a teacher, I’m really interested in my child’s education.  I know your children are not in elementary schools yet, but based on what you hear around town, how are the schools?  I know when I lived across the street from the middle school, I used to hear fighting (mostly girls!).  I also heard horror stories about the high school but I guess that’s a long time away.  I am an advocate of private schooling, as I went through the system, but now being on the other side…the side that’s actually paying…I’m not sure if we want to pay our taxes as well as foot the bill for schools.

2.  Where in Hoboken do you recommend us looking?  I know that Hoboken is situated in sections and you live in the SouthWest section.  We had a realtor bring us around yesterday and she showed us property there as well as the up and coming NorthEast (?) section by the movie theater.  We saw potential places in both sections.  My husband loves to walk so anywhere we live is fine with him even if it’s a 15 minute walk to the Path.

3.  Living where we are we have nice space.  Not too much, but not too little.  We share a backyard area with our row of townhouses and we spend a lot of time on our deck.  We also have a pool in our development that we unfortunately don’t visit enough during the summer.  How important is outside space to you?  I feel that once we lose it, we will regret not having it.

4.  Gyms.  I recently read you joined the Sky Club.  I used to be at Club H and heard the horror stories 5 years ago when the Sky Club gym went under.  No electricity, poor service, etc.  I’m guessing it’s all better now?  Again…my husband and his healthiness…is an avid gym goer.  I occasionally dabble.  Going to a decent gym is important to him and I told him that if we live where we live now, he would have to cut back on his gym visits after work from 4-5 days a week to 1-2 days a week.  That killed him but I was thinking I probably would kill him if he came home at 9 pm every night like he does now and I was home with the baby all day!  Other than the Sky Club and Club H, are there any other gyms you recommend?  Or even better, buildings that have stellar gym facilities?

Ok, all done!  I appreciate the time you took to read my email.  Whenever you get the chance, please respond back.  I look forward to hearing from you,

Sincerely,
T.

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My answer:

Hi, T.,

Glad to hear you liked the blog and found it informative! I have a two year old and four year old, and the short commute (35 minutes door to door) was definitely a huge part of why we bought our four-bedroom condo last year. I have lived in Hoboken for nine years, and the place is completely different from when we first moved here. It has gotten a lot more upscale and has a ton more grocery stores, such as Garden of Eden, Kings, A&P, and Shop Rite. There are also lots more kid-friendly facilities like Kidville (great gym classes and open playspace sessions for rainy/snowy days) and Monroe Center for the Arts (and host to tons of toddler dance classes).

Having my husband home early has been a blessing, especially since my two are only 18 months apart. He gets them up in the morning and is always home for bath and bedtime. We cosleep (groan) and trade off putting the kids to bed. That is how I was able to start working from home; he would put my daughter to bed while I got in a few hours of work each evening.

As far as schools go, the Hoboken public schools are excellent from pre-k up through sixth grade, plus there is a lot of selection. I toured the Wallace school and was impressed by the teachers as well as the ranked classes determined by state test scores. Hoboken Charter school goes all the way through high school and is pretty good, and there is always the possibility that the kids will test into High Tech High School (the bus picks up on Washington St and it’s about half an hour away). If we need to go the private route, the Hudson School tuition is only about $14k/year, which is definitely doable when combined with the relatively low property taxes. I am paying about $11k/year for a 2,100SF new construction four-bedroom (compared to $25k for a comparable property in Montclair). A large 3BR for sale in my building is paying under $10k in annual property taxes.

There are basically four quadrants to Hoboken plus a middle area around Willow Terrace. NE and SE are closer to transportation (ferry & PATH), Washington Street and the waterfront. They are pricier and are usually walkups without parking, plus the SE noise from bars and traffic can be quite intense on weekends. Willow Terrace has more houses but is farthest from public transportation, although the newly expanded HOP lines run past there.

NW and SW have the Light Rail and the most new construction. Some people prefer the NW because they can take the midtown bus through the Lincoln Tunnel and the uptown ferry. That is where there are the most vacant lots so expect a lot of construction in coming years. SW Hoboken is where the most housing was constructed over the last 5-8 years and is best for people who like to drive since that is the fastest place to get out of Hoboken to the turnpike and Holland Tunnel. It is also closest to Jersey City shopping (3.5% sales tax!) at the huge A&P, Target, BJs, Bed Bath & Beyond, Morton Williams and Newport Mall.

Many of the new construction condos in SW Hoboken have large gated communal courtyards. We have one in my building where my kids play with the neighbors’ kids, riding bikes and building snowmen. We used to have an enormous private outdoor patio attached to our two-bedroom; it was literally almost as big as the condo interior. But we found we didn’t use it as much as we expected. Between the snow, blazing sun, NO HOSE, and evening mosquitoes, we decided we needed some outdoor space (we have 120 SF) but that indoor space was more important for our family. I also found that appraisers don’t give you much more value for a large outdoor space versus a small one; small balconies in my old building received a $5k credit versus $10k for my enormous patio.

I toured a number of gyms around Hoboken when we first moved here, and Club H and the Sky Club are definitely the nicest. We had a pretty decent gym with sauna and steam room on the same floor as our two-bedroom condo but found we rarely used it (maybe 10 times in the 5 years we lived there). Most building gyms in Hoboken are pretty small and basic in equipment (the Hoboken Grande gym was actually the nicest I have ever seen).

The thing about building gyms is that you have to pay for their upkeep in your monthly maintenance, plus build repair/replacement costs into your reserve fund. I would much rather have the option to pay the extra $89/month rather than have it automatically built into my maintenance. If we are going to be in our four-bedroom for years then I want to keep our costs down. I absolutely love having the Sky Club across the street; they are open until 10pm, well after the kids go to bed, and the facility is clean and run well (great nursery for drop-offs). I know there were a lot of issues when the NJ Devils owned it, but it has been under new management for about a year now and I have found them to be very proactive and responsive. And I love the pool, it is by far the best one in Hoboken. My kids are great swimmers because we have it right across the street.

My standards for choosing a condo are a lot different from most people’s because I have been a condo board president for the last five years. I look for things like a completed transition engineering study to make sure there are no expensive construction issues, a healthy reserve fund to cover the inevitable capital repairs like a roof replacement, two elevators and trash compacters since I know how most buildings fail to properly maintain them (they need biannual servicing) and thus break frequently, and a great parking garage. The majority of indoor parking garages in Hoboken have spots that are too small for large cars (ie. minivans), and are poorly designed with weird columns all over the place. If I am committing to living in a place for 10+ years, I need to have a spacious parking spot in a garage that is easy to navigate, and I found everything I was looking for in my current building.

Congratulations on the impending arrival of your baby, and please feel free to email me if you have any more questions.

Kathy

Q. i live in a small condo assoc- and we are self managed. I recently took over as treasurer and handling providing documents for a neighbors sale. they asked for audits for 2 years? we gave them our budget for 2010 but we don’t have audits done- is this a legal requiement? Any insight would be beneficial. thanks.

A. A good friend who is a CPA says:

Audits are not legally required for NJ non-profit corporations with less than $250k in annual revenues.

It is based on the tax exempt certification. If it is 501(c)3 organization, any organization with revenue of $250k or more is required. There are several classifications under 501(c) so it would need to be looked at (some don’t
require audits).

Here are two links that may help.
http://www.njnonprofits.org/ReachUs.html
http://www.grantthornton.com/staticfiles/GTCom/files/Industries/NotForProfit/tax
_alert_2_16.pdf

Some owners are starting to receive hearing notices about their tax appeals. I emailed Adam Berkson, the founder of easytaxfix.com, for tips on what to bring to a hearing and received the following answer:

“One thing that I would try to do is get the comparable sales that the assessor is going argue. In some cases you can get them by calling the assessor’s office. That way you can poke holes in his argument, just as he/she will of yours.

I have also heard a bunch of examples of settlements at the court house, prior to the hearing which seems weird. Any additional evidence you have (pictures, different comps, appraisals) needs to be submitted 10 days prior to the hearing.

One thing I have been telling people in New Jersey that if there is a significant amount of money at stake (say over $2500) it may be worth getting an appraisal and bringing him to court with you. This will probably cost in the
neighborhood of $500 ($300 for the appraisal, $150 for his/her time) so I do not recommend this until first trying to get a settlement.”

Q. I am thinking of submitting some additional pictures. Does anyone know if they need to be submitted to both Hoboken and JC officials? How many copies etc?

A. To be safe, I would send the photos to the three offices where you mailed the initial application (include your block/lot/unit # so they know which property you are referencing).

The other thing I would do is talk to your neighbors! I know several owners in my building refinanced their units in 2009, and they got appraisals done as part of the refi process. See if they will share those appraisals with you; a comp in your own building is the strongest one possible.

Q. I was wondering if you personally heard anything on your appeal?  I have not yet.  I will call next week but I thought I would check in with you as the pulse of Hoboken. 

A. I have not heard anything yet about my appeal. Hoboken goes building to building with appeals; my building got reviewed last year in June, and there are a lot more appeals this year so it may be later.

Reader question about my 4/29 column, “Exploring Beyond Hoboken Via the Light Rail.”

Q. Hi, Kathy, thanks for sharing! This was good reading. Quick question, I know you have a car too.  I got so lazy now that I have one, even though I live on 4th and Jefferson close to the 2nd street light rail, I just always hop into the car to go to the Liberty Science center.  How do you convince yourself to use the light rail instead?  Is there some benefit as opposed to just hopping into the car?

A. Hi, glad you liked the column! I have to admit, it took me a while to regularly use the Light Rail. There were several things that helped spur me along:

1. Time. I ran into a neighbor at Liberty Science Center who took the light rail there several times a week, and after leaving together we arrived home at the exact same time (we drove, they took the light rail).
2. Traveling with other families. Taking two cars doesn’t work well when you have a large group, so the light rail is much more fun and convenient.
3. Cost. Parking at Liberty Science Center is $7 plus gas & tolls, one light rail ticket is $1.90 (going up to $2.10 on Saturday) and the kids ride for free.
4. Walks. Since the weather has gotten nice I have been walking everywhere, and at the end of a long day out, it’s a nice change of pace to hop on the light rail and arrive home quickly & easily. My kids LOVE it, so all I have to do to get them in the stroller is tell them we’re going to take the dinosaur train (what they call it).

Hope this helps!

My husband and I have been together for 15 years, married for 10. We have a 3.5 year old and a 2 y.o. The math is very simple; we didn’t feel ready to start a family until our early thirties.

We have both always wanted children very much; it was one of the things that led to us getting married when my husband was 23 (I can’t believe how young we were, but it seemed so right at the time). So what held us back? It wasn’t money, although waiting such a long time made it easier for us to save enough money to give us many options when we became parents. It wasn’t career either, although that was definitely a huge factor in the wait. Another major delay was life goals; it helped that my husband almost won fencing National Championships a few months before I became pregnant with our daughter.

It was more that whenever the topic came up approximately every six months, we would look at each other, say “Now?” and then simultaneously freak out at the idea of having a baby right then. We knew that our life would end when we became parents, and it did. But we have no regrets. We were extraordinarily lucky not to encounter any fertility issues, so our first child was born at the perfect time for us.

Becoming parents caused a titanic upheaval in our relationship dynamics. Our previously smooth, easy life became fraught with disruptions caused by a small, demanding, unpredictable family member who could not be reasoned with. All the things we took for granted, like free time, going out to dinner or to fencing practice, visiting bookstores, showering, talking, watching TV, suddenly became luxuries. Our expenses increased dramatically while our income was halved. And all that was before we had our second child when our daughter was 18 months old.

In retrospect, it’s a good thing we waited as long as we did to start our family because otherwise we might have resented our kids for the complete lifestyle change they caused. And yet we adore our children, and like them more and more as they grow older and become complete little people. You can actually hold conversations with both of them (my 2 y.o. too, it’s really incredible!) and reason with the older one (although sometimes when you ask her to clean up her toys, she tells you to go do it instead).

The real lesson that I learned was that when things get tough, when both parents are sleep-deprived and stressed, is that you take it out on each other, not on the kids. Everyone I know goes through this, no matter how much money they have. Unless you have enough money to hire round-the-clock child care, ultimately you and your spouse are the rear brigade. Hell, you are the front and center brigade. You are it, and it can be overwhelming. And even having family members assist only helps temporarily and can cause more strain than assistance since they can easily get in the way in a small living space.

The single greatest side benefit to my being home is that I can manage the kids very easily under any circumstances. My husband calls it “Mommy Magic.” I can get the kids calmed down and fed/bathed/hair combed, or whatever need they have been fighting my husband or mother about. There are two reasons for this: 1) I know their cues very well and can tell exactly what they need before they start showing signs of distress, and 2) they are used to being around me continually so they automatically fall into a smooth, calm routine when I take charge.

The kids play happily with each other because they have a familiar routine. They are not separated at all during the day except for a couple of dropoff classes, and they are used to interacting smoothly with me at all times. I am very happy to be home with them, and their contentment and growth is my greatest reward. Having children and staying home with them is not for everyone, but it has fulfilled me in a way I didn’t know I was missing before they were born.

Kathy, you have two kids and one will be in Abbott preschool this year.  Same as mine, only mine is behind a year.  I need to ask you advice on the board of education vote on April 20th.  Did you study the options/people?  I didn’t but would like to vote.  What’s a good option for us, families with small children?  I know it’s a very lazy question, but I didn’t do any research, and would still like to vote, so thought that it’s better than not voting….  Please forgive me if you find my request offending, I mean nothing by it, just want to help our kids and didn’t have the time this time…

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My response:
No, it’s okay, I am struggling with the same issue! I am definitely voting for three of the four Kids First slate members (Irene Sobolov, Rose Marie Markle & Jean Marie Mitchell). Not sure about Leon Gold since he is a newcomer, but unless I come up with a good alternative, I will vote for him.

The reason why I am voting for them is b/c they cut $4 million from the budget this year without taking any teachers out of the classrooms and I know there are extensive union contracts in place. Used to deal w/union negotiations when I was a hospital marketing director, and their contracts are ironclad. I just don’t believe Maureen Sullivan when she & her people keep saying there is tons more $ to cut. Life is rarely that simple or that fast since it has only been a year since the new board took over a year ago.

That’s it in a nutshell.

Kathy

Q. Just wondering how long it took after you filed before you found out the status?  I filed this about a month ago.  Did you get a phone call or a letter?

A. The tax appeal deadline was April 1, so I would give it until the end of the month before you call the Hoboken assessor’s office (201 420-2024) to find out the status. The appeals are dealt with on a per-building basis; I know my building was reviewed in June of 2009. However, there were many more appeals this year, so the timeline may be slower.

Part 1 of Property Tax Appeal discussion

Part 2: Property Tax Appeal: Do you need an attorney?

Part 3: Q&A on NJ property tax appeal

Kathy. First time living in Hoboken during the parade.  How bad will Saturday be? Should I get out of town?  Or just stay away from Washington?

My response:

Stay away from Washington St from Friday PM to Sunday AM. Our part of town isn’t bad in terms of driving (basically, you can), but I am planning to take the kids on a Saturday day trip, returning in the later afternoon, when the worst of the celebrations should be over.

The biggest problem in South West Hoboken is house parties since there are relatively few bars here. Since the police are cracking down on them this year, it should be quieter, but I would still get out of town during the daytime just to be safe.

Newspaper column about parenting in Hoboken on St. Patrick’s Day

Q: How long does the whole process take on average from mailing out the forms till approval?
A: The appeals are reviewed from building to building, so it depends on where your building falls in the review list. My building got reviewed in early June, and settlement offer letters were in the mail by the second week. You have to sign
and send them back to accept the offer. You have until August to accept a settlement before having to go to court.

If you win your appeal, the new lower assessment is retroactive back to January 1, so don’t worry about the timing of your appeal review. You can call the tax assessor’s office to find out your status at the end of April. In Hoboken the assessor is SAL A BONACCORSI at 201 420-2024.

Q: You have an assessment ratio on your blog but where did you get that from?
A: The 0.2716 is the current Hoboken tax ratio. More info at http://bit.ly/dfWh8n

Q: If I win my appeal, will I get a check in the mail?
A: No. The amount of your reduced assessment will be credited toward your next property tax bill, usually the third quarter. Make sure to contact your lender so you can lower your monthly escrow payment.

Q: I got a huge amount off my taxes last year when I appealed. Should I appeal this year?
A: Not unless your property is overassessed by more than 30%. Zillow gives a pretty good property value estimate, check it out to see whether you are still overassessed.

Q: If I hire an attorney, will I have to pay upfront?
A: In most cases, no. The attorneys represent property tax appeal clients on a contingency basis, which means they won’t bill you until after you get a credit on your property tax bill. If your appeal gets denied, you are typically responsible only for the $25 filing fee ($100 for properties assessed at over $500,000). Keep in mind that tax appeal attorneys only accept clients they are sure can get a reduction, so you might be paying a lot extra for unnecessary professional representation. There is usually an additional fee for going to court.

Q: The state documents for property tax appeals keep talking about appraisals. Do I need one?
A: No. They are talking about the assessed value, not an actual appraisal. If you happen to have one lying around from a recent refi, it can’t hurt if you have to go to court, but 70% of all appeals get settled before they get to court. The municipal assessor has a formula they use to determine whether to settle (ie. your property is assessed for more than 30% of the current market value, so they offer 10% off).

Property appraisals typically cost several hundred dollars, so they are not a standard part of a property tax appeal for attorney-filed appeals either.

Q: I bought my property in January. Can I file my appeal in my name?
A: No. Tax appeal credits are retroactive back to Jan 1, so you have to file in the name of the owner of record as of that date. You can still sign your name (ie. “Jane Doe for Prior Owner”). And the refund will get credited against your next property tax bill (usually third quarter) so no need to worry about receiving a check made out to the wrong name!

Part 1: What is a Property Tax Appeal?

Part 2: Property Tax Appeal: Do you need an attorney?